Desktop ETS systems

[Jimmie_A.]

Hello Geir,

I am sorry to hear that you think that LabVIEW users need to beg for features not to be removed. Our development on HW and SW is based a lot on feedback from people like yourself i.e. users of our products as well as on strategic decisions.

Sometimes when we add a feature that benefits lots of users performance wise such as SMP and processor affinity for multicore systems this might eventually hurt performance on some systems due to a slightly bigger footprint (disk and memory) and CPU usage.  

Sometimes we remove a feature, like in this case where we removed the floppy boot option in Vista, due to the fact that the disk imaging tools we use don’t support Vista. If there are lots of users that request this feature to be implemented again in MAX I am certain that R&D will look into it and see what kind of resources that needs to be set aside for implementing this. I know that this very question with the floppy boot option has been discussed within R&D. I will give R&D a heads-up on this thread.

[Jimmie_A.]

Double post // sorry for that.

Message Edited by Jimmie A. on 06-23-2008 03:09 AM

[geirove]

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Jimmie A. wrote:

Hello Geir,

I am sorry to hear that you think that LabVIEW users need to beg for features not to be removed. ...

Sometimes we remove a feature, like in this case where we removed the floppy boot option in Vista, due to the fact that the disk imaging tools we use don’t support Vista. If there are lots of users that request this feature to be implemented again in MAX I am certain that R&D will look into it and see what kind of resources that needs to be set aside for implementing this. I know that this very question with the floppy boot option has been discussed within R&D. I will give R&D a heads-up on this thread.

---

Hello Jimmie,

To include new features as a result of "popularity requests" I assume evryone think is good!

However, to remove a feature, and use a "poll" / "request form" as the means of deciding whether to include it again is another ballgame: 

If e.g. 20 % of your user base have used the removed feature in important projects, they may, as in this case, not even be aware that it is removed until the next time the need arises; then it may be to late to start filling in requests forms.......

What industrial projects need is stability, and the deveøopers and project leaders peace of mind being assured that NI & LV will still be there to back them up on deployed industrial projects when needed!

------------------

To continue where this thread started, I will later post detailed specifications on the two machines I have converted to RT so far (mind  you: You will need LV on XP to do this !).

Short spec on the two machines:

a) Abit SE6 motherboard.

     850 ms Realtek based Ethernet card did not work under ETS: Replaced with Intel Ethernet card with 82559 Chipset. Installation succeded the first time, even with a Soundblaster Sound card that should have been removed 🙂

b) IBM

[geirove]

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Jimmie A. wrote:

Hello Geir,

I am sorry to hear that you think that LabVIEW users need to beg for features not to be removed. ...

Sometimes we remove a feature, like in this case where we removed the floppy boot option in Vista, due to the fact that the disk imaging tools we use don’t support Vista. If there are lots of users that request this feature to be implemented again in MAX I am certain that R&D will look into it and see what kind of resources that needs to be set aside for implementing this. I know that this very question with the floppy boot option has been discussed within R&D. I will give R&D a heads-up on this thread.

---

Hello Jimmie,

To include new features as a result of "popularity requests" I assume evryone think is good!

However, to remove a feature, and use a "poll" / "request form" as the means of deciding whether to include it again is another ballgame: 

If e.g. 20 % of your user base have used the removed feature in important projects, they may, as in this case, not even be aware that it is removed until the next time the need arises; then it may be to late to start filling in requests forms.......

What industrial projects need is stability, and the deveøopers and project leaders peace of mind being assured that NI & LV will still be there to back them up on deployed industrial projects when needed!

------------------

To continue where this thread started, I will later post detailed specifications on the two machines I have converted to RT so far (mind  you: You will need LV on XP to do this !).

Short spec on the two machines:

a) Abit SE6 motherboard.

     i) Realtek based Ethernet card did not work under ETS:

     ii) Installed Intel Ethernet card with 82559 Chipset. Installation succeded the first time.

     iii) 850 Mhz Intel Pentium III processor

     iv) 256 MB RAM

     v) System runs While Loop with 10 uS (microsecond) Loop Time with 47 % cpu Load

b) IBM NetVista Machine

   i) Ethernet of unknown origin on Motherboard: Worked the first time around!

   ii) 1.6 GHZ Pentium IV processor

   iii) 384 MB RAM

   iv) System runs While Loop with 2 uS (microsecond) Loop Time with 67 % Cpu Load

However, I am unable to format the Hard Drive of the IBM: I have created a "Format Disk" (On a XP System with LV installed). But when the Boot disk asks if I want to format the hard drive (Yes / No) the Keyboard no longer works ! It works before that: I can press F1 and enter the BIOS. Have tried all kinds of BIOS settings to no avail. I boot this machine from a Floppy, and use it for internal testing.

Request: Creating Boot & Format CD's would also be nice: There is a lot of problems with unaligned floppy disks that can not be read accross different floppy drives !

Message Edited by geirove on 06-23-2008 01:33 PM

[rolfk]

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@geirove wrote:

To include new features as a result of "popularity requests" I assume evryone think is good!

However, to remove a feature, and use a "poll" / "request form" as the means of deciding whether to include it again is another ballgame: 

If e.g. 20 % of your user base have used the removed feature in important projects, they may, as in this case, not even be aware that it is removed until the next time the need arises; then it may be to late to start filling in requests forms.......

What industrial projects need is stability, and the deveøopers and project leaders peace of mind being assured that NI & LV will still be there to back them up on deployed industrial projects when needed!

---

As Jimmie already has explained the imaging tools they use to create the floppies do not support Vista so far. So the question is not so much about removing a feature as adding a new platform to the supported platform. And then one has to evaluate every single component and if you find out a certain component (floppy disk imaging) does not support on the new platform you have basically three choices as developer:

1) Make the component support that new platform. Obviously the best choice for the end user but that may be a serious development effort and there might be not enough resources to do this right away since there are a lot more urgent projects that need to be finished first.

2) Make the rest work on the platform and remove the features that depend on this component from that platform version. People will complain because of "removed" features but they still can use the rest of the software on that new platform.

3) Decide that the product is not useful without that feature and postbone its adaption to the new platform until there is more pressure and/or more resources available.

Obviously  number 3 is the least user friendly choice but it would have been crystal clear from beginning that Vista is completely out of question for your project.

It's not that a features was removed really but that a new supported platform was added to MAX. The alternative simply might have been to entirely not support Vista in MAX.

Rolf Kalbermatter

[Riconquistiamola]

Manufacturer:  AMPRO
Model:  Core Module 620
500Mhz AMD Geode LX800 processor
Front Side Bus:  400Mhz
Intel 82551QM Ethernet
IDE CompactFlash

[PauloM]

Hi Michael,

Does your post means you tried that configuration successfully?

Did anyone try the AMD Geode LX800 with RT?

It is not in the list of compatible processors and I want to buy a motherboard with it, but am not sure if it works in RT.

Thanks a lot.

Paulo