video converter

[eweltmer]

Hi All,

I am trying to replace some existing rs-170 monitors using a video capture card (PCI-1409).

After installation, the video signal is degraded even in low level "MAX".

As an alternative I have used a video converter box that takes the rs-170 signal and converts it to firewire.

(canopus, ADVC-55).

Using the standard Windows software the fidelity is great but I can't get Labview to recognize the converter.

Does anyone have experience or can direct me to a listing of acceptable LV firewire converters?

Thank You,

Earl

[Robert_Eastlund]

Dear Earl,

If the ADVC-55 supports Directshow, you might want to see if you can access the video using NI-IMAQ for USB cameras.

However, I am puzzled by the difficulties that you are having with the PCI-1409.  Please upload an example image.

-Robert

[eweltmer]

Hi Robert,

Thank you for the information.

I have used this set-up file and was able to get a response from MAX.

Under IMAQ dx folder the converter reads "61883 device".

NI requires that the devices are "Dcam" or "IIDC" (same thing I am told) compliant.

In checking with NI, this is a generic response for devices that are non compliant with NI's format.

All "Canopus" devices are not Dcam compliant and use another format, hence, no drivers.

NI has been very helpful and will give the list of compliant converter boxes.

The problem we have with the PCI-1409 ard is that there is some artifact in the image.

Although this is very subtle, it is objectionable to our customers who look at images constantly.

We ran across this problem some time ago (I forgot) and used a Matrox Meteor II card as a substitute.

Attached are two pictures showing the difference.

The first is the image as seen on the monitor (or close).

The second is the slight artifact on the image.

These are "gold on carbon" as seen on an electron microscope.

The gold "pools" show up as bright portions on a carbon (black) background.

On the first image (test 8), a small (1 pixel) vertical line can be seen in the upper left corner to the right of the  "WD10" text.

Other vertical lines can be seen if you look closely.

The second image (Test 2) does not have this artifact.

The actual images are more dramatic.

Anyway, thanks for your help.

Earl

[michaeld]

Earl,

You are correct that any FireWire device must be compliant with the DCAM (IIDC) protocol in order to communicate with our IMAQdx drivers. Unfortunately, we don't have a list of any compatible RS-170 to FireWire convertors, so I can't provide you with any kind of recommendations. Do you have to stick with the RS-170 camera? You might consider purchasing a regular machine vision FireWire camera to replace the analog one.

Regarding your problem with the RS-170 camera, can you post an image of the settings you have in MAX? Also, I'm having a difficult time identifying the artifacts, could you post a picture and highlight the areas that have them?

[eweltmer]

Hi Muchael,

Here is the picture with a box around the artifact.

As I mentioned it is very subtle on the photos but much more apparent in real time.

Thanks for your help.

Earl

[michaeld]

Earl,

Does this problem happen with multiple cameras? Do the noise lines stay in one place or do they fluctuate throughout the image as time goes by? One thing you want want to check is to make sure that the camerafile for your 1409 is in fact set to RS-170 and not NTSC. Have you tried this out with a different cable? Also, make sure that your camera and system are not in a noisy environment.

[eweltmer]

Dear Michael,

Only one camera was used.

The cable is a "BNC" cable.

The system is not in a noisey environment.

We went through this process a few years ago and tracked down the potential problems: noisey environment, stray magnetic fields, poor grounding, poor shielding, etc.

The environment has less than 3 mg stray fields,

the mechanical displacement is less than 5 u in. in all directions,

the computer is grounded to the equipment,

 the video lines are all shielded as they are BNC cables and connectors.

We only changed one parameter: the video capture card.

When we went from the PCI-1409 to the Matrox Meteor II the results were dramatic.

Mind you, I am sure that the Meteor II is now obsolete as the PCI-1409 is also aged, but this was not an inexpesive task.

The Meteor II card was about twice the cost of the NI card and the LV drivers were an additional amount.

But in the end we felt it was worthwhile as I said, "the results  were dramatic".

In looking at both cards, the Matrox card had much more ground plane area but in the end, it was better.

I am now looking for a simpler, inexpensive solution. Hopefully through the video converter box.

Thank You,

Earl

[zuolanwang]

Quote: "NI has been very helpful and will give the list of compliant converter boxes."

Can someone post the link to this list?

Thanks.

[Charlie_P]

Good Evening zuolanwang,

As michaeld said in the post directly after the one you quoted,

---

Unfortunately, we don't have a list of any compatible RS-170 to FireWire convertors, so I can't provide you with any kind of recommendations.

---

In the year and a half since this post has gone untouched, I am still not aware of any such list.  If you can provide the community with some more inforamation about your application we may be able to assist you.

[BruceAmmons]

I found a converter that might work for you:

http://www.theimagingsource.com/en_US/products/converters/dfg13941e/

I would call and ask them if it is IIDC compatible.  If it is, you should be able to acquire using the standard NI firewire drivers.  If not, it looks like they have LabVIEW drivers available for download.  I would assume one way or another you could get the images into LabVIEW.

They also have a USB version, which could be an option.  It is a little cheaper, but then you would need to buy the NI Vision Acquisition drivers.  I didn't check to see if they have LabVIEW drivers for that one.

Bruce